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What DO two Americans living in Bosnia (or anywhere else) who want to marry in Italy have to do to make it happen (or, "The Italian bureaucracy, almost worse than the US bureaucracy, but not as bad as Spain’s")............Especially humorous are the articles at the very bottom of this page!...

We first found out about the bureaucracy of the Italian marriage process from the following email from my mother:

Dear Rachel,

The inactive phone system at the Italian Consulate in NYC and I, by now, have developed an intimate relationship on the in's and out's of getting married in Italy. They have provided no means for speaking to a human being, so I've gleaned this much from their message.

l. The American couple must appear at the civil registry of the city in which they wish to be married to declare their intention to be married with two witnesses.

2. With them, they must bring the following documents:
a. a valid American passport
b. birth certificate with the names of both parents on it
c. final decrees of divorce
d. declaration sworn to at the American consular office in Italy that according to U.S. law, there are no obstacles to the marriage
e. an affidavit sworn to by 4 witnesses who are over 18 and not related to the couple that the couple are free to contract marriage. This affidavit must be sworn to at the Italian consular office or at the local preturra within 3 months of the marriage.

3. Following the successful completion of the above, bans must be posted at the local city hall for 2 consecutive Sundays before the marriage.

4. On the 4th day following the 2nd Sunday of the week in which the bans have been posted, the couple may be married by the civil registrar or by a clergyman. (they must mean, no sooner than 4 days after the 2nd Sunday, otherwise, there would be chaos every Thursday in Italy--maybe there is and I just didn't notice it when I was there 30 years ago.)

5. The clergyman must register the marriage with the ufficiale di state civile (I assume that's the same as the civil registrar) for the marriage to be legal.

This afternoon, I'm giving a call to a Mr. Mastrostefano in the Italian Consular Office in Philadelphia with hopes of talking with a human being and to confirm that the msg. on the NYC office machine is right. Actually, the NYC office only handles NY, CT and certain counties in NJ. Somerset isn't one of them. How do I know that? Well, I called the Italian Govt. Tourist Board in NYC and told them I needed to talk to a person. He scrounged around for 5 mins. and finally gave me a number to get into the consular office around the answering machine. It was the guy I reached who told me I have to call Philly--they handle Somerset. Who knows? Maybe the rules are different in Phila.

I'm sending you this information without comment because Daddy says I'm not allowed to.

Hugs to Roger and love to you, Mom

Persons wishing to be married in Italy must appear with two witness and make a declaration of their intention to marry before the Ufficiale dello Stato Civile (Civil Registrar) of the city or town in which the marriage is to take place. At the time of making their declaration, the couple must present all the required documents (see below). Following the declaration, it is usually necessary for bans to be posted at the local Comune (town hall) for two consecutive Sundays before the marriage [ *The posting of bans was waived for us outta-towners ]

On the fourth day following the second Sunday on which the bans are posted or any time after the bans have been waived, the couple may be married in a civil or religious ceremony. It should be noted here that unless the couple is married by the Roman Catholic church, they MUST have a civil marriage ceremony for the marriage to be legal.

Then I received another email from my mother:

Dear Rachel, Gosh, it was swell to talk with you.... shortly after Signor Mastrostefano called and elucidated even further the Italian way of doing things. Needed documents:

1. Passport (nothing changed here)
2. Birth Certificates (must be translated into Italian and "legalized" by the Secretary of State in the state in which they were issued).
3. Divorce decrees (ditto in Italian-we may be the world's imperial power, but we obviously haven't taken over Italy yet.)
4. Declaration sworn at the American consular office in Italy that there are no obstacles according to US law to getting married (no change).
5. Affidavit sworn to by 4 (according to Sr. Mastrostefano, it's 2) that you're free to marry (no mention about this having to be done 3 months. in advance).
6. Posting of the bans (he said that since you're not Italian, you can probably get an exemption, but that can only be done by the appropriate municipal office in Italy and since this seems to be going in a particular direction, I'd venture that the referred to office is open on alternate Tuesdays in odd numbered months, between the hours of 10:00 and 10:08 and 4:00 and 4:23 Central Italian
Time which is 30 minutes after Cinqueterre Italian Time and 45 minutes before Venice is Sinking Italian Time).

I have just penned a letter to the NY Consulate telling them that their message machine is fucked up--in my finest Italian, of course "la macchina e tutta fuquita alta"--and begging them to send me a written copy of the instructions. I'm hoping when they see that we live in Warren, NJ, they will make the mistake common to everyone outside Warren Township and think that we really live in Warren County which falls under the diocese of NY, as opposed to Somerset County in the diocese of Philadelphia. The split between church and state is an American thing.

Anyway, as long as I'm having fun, I'll call Union County (where you were born) tomorrow to see if they have an Italian hanging around who waits to get requests to translate birth certificates. It might not be a bad idea when you get home to dedicate one day to calling/visiting/whatever it takes at the Italian Embassy in DC to get done here whatever needs to be done, eg., the sworn affidavit with two witnesses that you're not really first cousins.

The following documents must be presented to the Ufficiale dello Stato Civile when making a declaration of intention to marry. These documents (since they were all issued outside of Italy) had to be translated into Italian and legalized by the Apostille of the US State in which they were issued....

  American Passport (no need for translation here)
  Birth Certificate which must show the names of both parents (Rachel's in New Jersey, Roger's in California)
  Evidence of termination of any previous marriage, i.e., final divorce decrees or death certificates.
  Sworn statement of consent of marriage by parents in the citizen is underage
  Declaration of American Authority stating that there are no obstacles under American law to the marriage (the US consulate in Florence has a statement all ready)
  An affidavit (called an "atto notorio"), sworn by two witnesses (not relatives) before either an Italian Consular Office outside Italy (we thought the Italian Embassy in Sarajevo could help here), or in Italy at a Pretura or before a Mayor, Town Clerk, or Notary Public, stating that the American citizen is free to contract marriage.

So while my mother spent weeks getting documents translated into Italian and then notarized/legalized in four different states, Roger and Rachel took four friends to the Italian Embassy in Sarajevo to get the atto notorio signed and sealed.

1/9/98 from Mom:

Dear R&R, I talked with both the WA and ID translation services and will fax them your documents tomorrow when I go to Stroudsburg and can use the fax machine in Alice's office for free. Veronica Medda in the Boise company remembered your call and was particularly cordial. She even offered to take the completed translation over to the Secy. of State's office two doors away to get the apostille before she sends it back. Isn't small wonderful? So, unless anything unforeseen happens, I expect those two jobs will be completed by the time we get back from TX.

On the CA translation of your birth certificate, I'm holding off for the while. The Berlitz people charge $250 + 10% of that for notarization which comes to $275 which even for CA amounts to usury. I'm sure it can be done just as well and for less, so tomorrow I'll check out CA phone directories in the library to see what I can get. The fee in WA is a minimum of $70 with $5 for notarization and in ID the charge is .12 a word. So, you can see that $275 is way out of line. I think they may be cashing in on the Berlitz name. And, since we have time... Hugs, Ef

Mr. Romano Salsarola of the Ambasciata D'Italia (the consulate) in Bosnia was not sure what exactly we needed to have in order to get married in Italy. After a very nice meeting with me, he explained that he was really an Economics officer and he would have to read through some of the texts of regulations to get it all clear. Later he wrote me the following:

9 February 1998, Sarajevo

Dear Miss Peterson:

In order to prepare the document you require, I will need the following information:

  For you, your husband to-be I will need:
    Full and complete names
    Date of birth
    Place of birth
    Passport Number
    Date of Issue/Place of Issue
    Social Security Number
    Home of record (full address)
    Current address
    Profession
    Blood type
    Father's full name, date of birth, full home address
    Mother full name (including maiden name), date of birth, full home address
  For your four witnesses I will need:
    Full and complete name
    Date/Place of Birth
    Passport Number
    Date of issue/place of issue
    Social Security Number
    Home of Record
    Current Address
    Profession
    Father's full name, date of birth, full home address
    Mother full name (including maiden name), date of birth, full home address

Finally, I need to remind you that, besides the "Atto di Notorieta", you must produce to the Registrar in Florence the following documentation: full birth certificate, sworn statement by your parents, rendered before the Registrar, to the effect that you and your fiancé are not blood relations, and the required documentation issued by the US Consulate General in Florence.

The Ambassador will address your witnesses with the following words:

"Conscious of the responsibility you undertake with your sworn statement before God and Men, swear to tell the truth, and nothing but the truth."

Each of the witnesses then must say in turn: "I swear"

The substance of the sworn statement may be resumed as follows:

"We affirm, on our conscience, that none of the impediments stated in the following articles (85, 86, 87, 88, 89 of the Italian Civil Code, do apply in the matter of the marriage of Mr. Roger B. Bird with Ms. Rachel Peterson, who we know to be free to marry."

ARTICLES:

  No known mental illness of either party that may constitute an impediment to the marriage;
  Neither Party is presently married;
  The Parties are not blood relations in the first of second degree;
  No conviction for murder or attempted murder on the spouse of the other contracting party;
  Neither party to this marriage has lived with his or her divorced partner during the last 300 days.

WELL, ALL OF OUR WITNESSES SWORE THAT NONE OF THE IMPEDIMENTS STATED IN THESE FIVE ARTICLES APPLIED TO OUR MARRIAGE (although there was some discussion of article 85 - on the phone later my father asked, "is that like, 'He drools, but he's faithful?")

The civil ceremony took place in the Red Room, but to get the paperwork complete, we had to visit the US Consulate first: Lungarno Vespucci, 38 (how appropriate!) tel: 55.239.8276, and then visit the Ufficio Matrimoni in the Palazzo Vecchio from 8,30 - 13,00, tel: 55.276.8518 or 55.276.8276. Our paperwork then needed to be stamped, etc. in the Prettura in the Ufficio Matrimoni, room number 57, tel: 55.264.271. And after it was all said and done, it cost us 300,000 lire to be married in Florence (the certificate anyway!).

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